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Automated Trading Championship 2010 - page 5

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Rosh:
Sorry, I made a little mistake. You can have not more than 3 orders (order does not mean open position) but you can have an open position for every Symbol.

PIX'S NOTE: This post contains incorrect info. Please see Rosh follow up here for reply: https://www.mql5.com/en/forum/746/page5/#comment_8087 

Clarification?:

Position: Direction (long or short)
Order: Limit, Market, Stop, etc.
Entry Point: Entry price

So:
* single Position (direction) per Symbol
* max three Orders pending (not yet executed) on all Symbols
* max 5 lots per Order
* max 15 lots in a single Position (direction) per Symbol
* one can enter multiple times with different Entry Points in the same direction (Position) on each Symbol given the previous restrictions

Suggestion: To simplify, only allow a max amount of lots to be opened per account.
Rationale: Not only does this simplify the rules and trading, but it restrains lucky, over leveraged Expert Advisors from winning the competition. If only, say, 30 lots total were allowed to be opened at any given time per account, then the most "skillful" Expert Advisors will gain an advantage over uber-leveraged pot-luck Expert Advisors.

Automated Trading Championship 2010
  • www.mql5.com
Automated Trading Championship 2010.

Rosh, you make me confuse now.

Please clarify following items for me (is my understanding true/not?)

1. For all symbols, I can open as many as "positions" that I want,  as long as the lot total is less than 15 lots and each position size cannot be greater than 5 lots.

2. For each symbol, I can only open 3 "orders" at maximum.

Example1:

1st Position = EURUSD (1lot), 2st Position = EURUSD(1lot), 3st Postion = GBPJPY (0.5 lot), 4st position = EURUSD (0.5 lot). Lot total is 3 lots and no position greater than 5 lot

Is it ok/not?

To clarify some of the questions that have arisen recently from a number of users, I will explain some of the following examples:
  1. There can be no more than 3 (pending) orders at the same time for all Symbols. An Order is a request to open a position (whether it is done now or in the near future), the number of orders can be obtained through the function OrdersTotal().
  2. The volume of the (pending) order cannot exceed 5 lots.
  3. It is important that we do not mix up an order with an open position. A position is the result of an executed Buy or Sell of a Symbol. For each Symbol, at any given time, only one position can be opened – whether it is to buy or to sell. There are no limitations on the number of open positions, but since the rules of the ATC 2010 only allow trading 12 instruments (Symbols), only 12 positions can be opened at any given time during the Championship. This is a natural limitation, enforced by the market environment. The number of open positions can be obtained through the function PositionsTotal().
  4. For each instrument (Symbol) the total volume of the (open) position and (pending) orders cannot exceed 15 lots, regardless of the direction of the position or the type of order. Let's use the EURUSD currency pair to analyze some possible examples. For example if we have an open position for 15 lots, then we cannot have any pending orders for this Symbol. However, the placed Stop Loss and Take Profit are not considered pending orders. The results:
    • For a EURUSD we can have a position with 5 lots, and two orders, each with a volume of 5 lots (for example one Buy Stop and one Sell Stop order)
    • Or we can have a position with 10 lots, and only one order with a 5 lot volume
    • Or we can have a position with 10 lots, and up to 3 orders, with a total volume not exceeding 5 lots. Volume of position + total volume of orders <= 15 lots.
  5. The presence of a position for a Symbol can be checked using the function PositionSelect(), the volume of the specified position can be obtained through the function PositionGetDouble()  
  6. We can find out the volume of a pending order through the function  OrderGetDouble()


Rosh:
  1.  An Order is a request to open a position (whether it is done now or in the near future), the number of orders can be obtained through the function OrdersTotal().

do u mean that opened position is included in "Order" ?

 

by the way , i think the definition of scalping is too loose.

i recommend scalping definition should be 3 time of the spread. that is eurgbp (most used currency for scalping) --> 6 pips

when the market change 2-4 %, the scalping EA hit the SL easily

so meaningless for using championed scalping EA in reality

kelly:

do u mean that opened position is included in "Order" ?

It says:

It is important that we do not mix up an order with an open position.


Regarding the Rules of Championship limitations for three orders is related to pending orders. To read about the orders in general see the Help of client terminal:

Market Order

Market order is a commitment to the brokerage company to buy or sell a security. Execution of this order results in the execution of a deal. The price of a deal depends on the execution mode, which depends on the symbol type. Generally, a security is bought at the Ask price and sold at the Bid price.

Pending Order

Pending order is the client's commitment to the brokerage company to buy or sell a security at pre-defined conditions in the future. The following types of pending orders are available:

  • Buy Limit — trade request to buy at the Ask price that is equal to or better than that specified in the order. The current price level is higher than the value in the order. Usually this order is placed in anticipation of that the security price, having fallen to a certain level, will increase;
  • Buy Stop — trade request to buy at the Ask price that is equal to or better than that specified in the order. The current price level is lower than the value in the order. Usually this order is placed in anticipation of that the security price, having reached a certain level, will keep on increasing;
  • Sell Limit — trade request to sell at the Bid price that is equal to or better than that specified in the order. The current price level is lower than the value in the order. Usually this order is placed in anticipation of that the security price, having increased to a certain level, will fall;
  • Sell Stop — trade request to sell at the Bid price that is equal to or better than that specified in the order. The current price level is higher than the value in the order. Usually this order is placed in anticipation of that the security price, having reached a certain level, will keep on falling;
  • Buy Stop Limit — this type is the combination of the two first types being a stop order for placing Buy Limit. As soon as the future Ask price reaches the value indicated in the order, a Buy Limit order will be placed at the level, specified in the order. The current price is lower than that, reaching which the pending order will be placed.
  • Sell Stop Limit — this type is a stop order for placing Sell Limit. As soon as the future Bid price reaches the value indicated in the order, a Sell Limit order will be placed at the level, specified in the order. The current price is higher than that, reaching which the pending order will be placed. The pending order price is higher than the price of its placing.

Rosh,

just ask.... do permitted the open position is a same symbols repeat for 3 times ? ie EURUSD with a position with 5 lots, and two orders position are same, total will be 15 lots for only 1 symbols?

haidzatul:

Rosh,

just ask.... do permitted the open position is a same symbols repeat for 3 times ? ie EURUSD with a position with 5 lots, and two orders position are same, total will be 15 lots for only 1 symbols?

Yes, you can place two pending orders on the same Symbol with volume 5 lots for each if you have no more than one pending order before (regardless a symbol). And your open position on the same position with volume no more than 5 lots.
Rosh:
To clarify some of the questions that have arisen recently from a number of users, I will explain some of the following examples:
  1. There can be no more than 3 (pending) orders at the same time for all Symbols. An Order is a request to open a position (whether it is done now or in the near future), the number of orders can be obtained through the function OrdersTotal().
  2. The volume of the (pending) order cannot exceed 5 lots.
  3. It is important that we do not mix up an order with an open position. A position is the result of an executed Buy or Sell of a Symbol. For each Symbol, at any given time, only one position can be opened – whether it is to buy or to sell. There are no limitations on the number of open positions, but since the rules of the ATC 2010 only allow trading 12 instruments (Symbols), only 12 positions can be opened at any given time during the Championship. This is a natural limitation, enforced by the market environment. The number of open positions can be obtained through the function PositionsTotal().
  4. For each instrument (Symbol) the total volume of the (open) position and (pending) orders cannot exceed 15 lots, regardless of the direction of the position or the type of order. Let's use the EURUSD currency pair to analyze some possible examples. For example if we have an open position for 15 lots, then we cannot have any pending orders for this Symbol. However, the placed Stop Loss and Take Profit are not considered pending orders. The results:
    • For a EURUSD we can have a position with 5 lots, and two orders, each with a volume of 5 lots (for example one Buy Stop and one Sell Stop order)
    • Or we can have a position with 10 lots, and only one order with a 5 lot volume
    • Or we can have a position with 10 lots, and up to 3 orders, with a total volume not exceeding 5 lots. Volume of position + total volume of orders <= 15 lots.
  5. The presence of a position for a Symbol can be checked using the function PositionSelect(), the volume of the specified position can be obtained through the function PositionGetDouble()  
  6. We can find out the volume of a pending order through the function  OrderGetDouble()


Rosh, sorry for asking again.

In point no 3 you say that for each symbol, at any given time only one "position" can be opened. However you state in point no 4 that people can still open "order" for the same symbol as long as it not exceeded 15 lots. My question is:if this "order" ,due to it hits the stop limit it will then become a "position" right?, and will it be contradicted with your point no.3 to only allowed single position for each symbol? 


Hi, To someone living kindly.

in the Rule Official　 the sentence says,

　･ Make a minimum of 5 non-demo trades in the first 8 months of testing (2010.01.01 - 2010.08.01) and in the 3 months of the contest

please teach me the meaning　of　 "non-demo trade"  without  laughing at me.

what does it mean?

Does any real money move in Championship?

As I'm not good at English, I can't  understand. 


thanks for kindness.


riyo:

Rosh, sorry for asking again.

In point no 3 you say that for each symbol, at any given time only one "position" can be opened. However you state in point no 4 that people can still open "order" for the same symbol as long as it not exceeded 15 lots. My question is:if this "order" ,due to it hits the stop limit it will then become a "position" right?, and will it be contradicted with your point no.3 to only allowed single position for each symbol? 


See MetaTrader 5 Trading System

The trading system in MetaTrader 5 differs from that of MetaTrader 4 in its basics. First of all, four types of trade operation execution are supported in MetaTrader 5: Market, Instant, Request and Exchange. Secondly, the new terminal accepts the strict delimitation between the notions of Order, Trade and Position.

  • Order. This is the direction to a brokerage company to buy or sell a financial security. There are two major types of orders: market and pending. Two more special orders are available in the new terminal - Take Profit and Stop Loss.
  • Trade. It`s the fact of security buying or selling. A Buy is performed at the Ask price, while Sell is done at the Bid price. A trade can be opened as the result of market order execution or pending order activation.
  • Position. It`s a market obligation, number of bought or sold security contracts. A long position is a symbol bought expecting the security price raise. A short position is the obligation to supply it expecting the further price fall. Only one position for a certain security can exist on a trade account.


Differences between trade positions in MetaTrader 4 and MetaTrader 5

Besides the Buy and Sell market orders, 6 types of pending orders are supported:

  • Buy Limit is a trade Buy order at the Ask price equal to or better than that indicated in the order. Usually orders of this type are placed expecting that the symbol price falls till a certain level and starts raising then.
  • Buy Stop is a trade Buy order at the Ask price equal to or better than that indicated in the orders are placed when a security price us expected to get over a certain level and continue growing.
  • Sell Limit is a trade order to sell at the Bid price that is equal to or better than that indicated in the order. In this case a security price is expected to raise till a certain level and go downwards after that.
  • Sell Stop is a trade order to sell at the Bid price that is equal to or better than that indicated in the order. The current price level is above the value indicated in the order. Usually such orders are placed when a security is expected to fall down to a certain level and continue the downward moving.
  • Buy Stop Limit - this type of orders is the combination of the first two types being a stop order for placing a Buy Limit order. As soon as the Ask price reaches the specified value, a Buy Limit order will be placed at the level indicated in the order. The current price level is lower than that, reaching which a pending order will be set.
  • Sell Stop Limit - this type is the stop order to place a Sell Limit order. As soon as the future Bid price reaches the value specified in the order, a Sell Limit will be placed for the level indicated in the order. Here the current price level is above the value, reaching which a pending order will be placed. The price of the pending order is above the level of its placing.


Pending Orders in MetaTrader 5 Client Terminal

All these possibilities enable you to flexibly control all trading activities and implement almost any trading strategy.

How Does It Work?

An order to execute a trade with indicated parameters is sent to a broker from the client terminal. The order correctness is checked on the server. Are all the parameters (balance, lot, price, etc.) indicated correctly? If any of parameters does not meet the requirements, the order is rejected. If everything is correct, a trade order is placed to the Order Queue, after which it is sent to a dealer or to the market. An order can be also rejected in the market (stock exchange) or by the dealer.


Trading operations Execution in MetaTrader 5

An order turns into a trade if all its parameters are correct and it has been executed in the market. Depending on the current position for the security, the trade can result in the position increase, decrease or closing.

Example: we've got one position for EURUSD 1 Lot. If another lot is bought, the position will be increased to 2 lots. If 1 lot is sold, the position will be closed. If 0.7 lots are sold, the position will diminish to 0.3 lots.

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