Why most Lose Trading? - page 3

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Walander
576
Walander  

Look Gardner,

Stop talking like some 16 yr old cool fatcat who's just discovered Forex.

Go back to your Russian Roullete you so brilliantly explained that nearly provided you with 1000% return with your neat disclaimer, don't contact me about it.

You think I'm stupid? What I know is that when a KID who seems to have all these wonderful money making experiences seems to appear on the board out of nowhere. It generally isn't a good sign.

jlgardner263:
Mmm, yessum, Good Kittie, you're the best stupid decision I ever made. And then while we're at it let's have some millumaide. What do you want from me? I just want to not have to suffer this animosity everywhere I speak a sentence. I wrote a book.... do you want to read that? I'm sorry, I only give the first chapter away for free. It has nothing to do with Forex but I suppose you'll cry bs on that, too... I'm sorry, it has a lot to do with faith and blah blah blah blah. Is there a mute button on this b atch? Why, my friend?

I'm not your friend, buddy!

I'm not your buddy, pal!

I'm not your pal, guy!

I'm not your guy, buddy!

Must it continue. If so, I don't know, what's your deal? I don't typically think, type, talk, or act this way, something must be setting me off... I believe it's you. I believe I have better things to do, but I have this deal where I don't want others to be discouraged, so somehow I'm still here making a child of myself when I could be sleeping and waiting for the next glorious day. I don't understand why you're trying to make this out to be harder than it really is. These concepts work. I simply want to answer this person's question, and yet, here it comes: I don't believe you! What do I care? I don't know why I care, but somehow I do. It's something to do with you. I just want to get through to you, that being angry just turns off all the people that could be of benefit to you.

So here, one last time, you can trade any gosh durn (yes, I said that) system that you want, and in the end, whether you are profitable trader or not comes down to... who?

You.
jlgardner263
56
jlgardner263  

Okay, seriously everybody, I thought this was an open community where we could all discuss real things in a real environment without any sort of judgment upon who we are, where we come from, etc.

I apologize for getting in this e-brawl with Walander, I honestly know nothing about him, but at this point do not care to learn anything about him.

I am new to this forum. Does that make me new to trading?

Answer that for yourself.

I speak of faith and confidence... does that make me a fake?

I believe not. Because I do have faith and confidence in my self. I separate my and self. I do that for a reason.

In all honesty none of you know anything about me. To call me a kid is ridiculous. I am almost thirty years old. How old are you? Who cares? I don't. I've found that my niece and nephew at my age minus ten years are as smart as I am. This is not the kind of welcome I would expect from a community of people for simply trying to express my beliefs on a topic.

I am not the type of person that likes to get into bickering matches, and yet here I am. I have just recently started posting on this forum, but I have avidly read posts and tested new ideas for months now, I don't understand why my poking my head in deserves criticism like this.

I think it is wise to consider what other people have to say before you bash, slash, and completely deny it. I don't expect much lasting success for those who have no faith in themselves. In my line of belief, there is no way to succeed without faith in something. I believe (have faith) in my own ability to trade the currency market as much as I believe in the system that I use (developed and tested! on my own) that I will throw my real money down on it. If I lost it all, I really could give a yeah, because there's more where that came from. But that's not going to happen, because, as my friend here states in his profile, "I did my homework first."

I actually didn't have to do my homework first, as I traded the stock market for 7 years. These markets function generically the same. I could trade commodities, oil, gold, forex, stocks, whatever, and achieve the same results (I would just have to be more patient.)

I could screw the whole trading game and go with a slew of other ideas that would work just as well, but I genuinely enjoy my job. I don't plan on leaving it, because it provides opportunities to help people that I otherwise wouldn't have. That's all I'm about. I want to help people. If you're the kind of person that wants to converse with someone who wants to help you out of no self interest (and yes, there is no self interest here, I am not promoting anything, I am not trying to sell you anything, I am asking for nothing, anything I do here does not earn me anything) then by all means contact me.

In regards to Roulette, I actually played European and American Roulette. This was just for fun. If you're familiar with roulette, you will know that Russian Roulette involves a revolver loaded with one bullet, and American and European Roulette are table games that you play at casinos. It's the one where the wheel spins and the ball lands on black or red. That's a very simple way of explaining it, but it should do well for a simple mind. The only reason I mentioned it was in regards to the Martingale system the boy was talking about. I played Roulette martingale style. It is a table game. It is one of my favorite games to this day, and I will tell you that if you would like to hook up in Vegas I will rape the roulette tables using my system. But in the end it's all for fun. I enjoy having fun. Sue me.

But I cannot prove this, nor will I attempt to. I know what happened, and who cares.

Thank you

xx3xxx
1754
xx3xxx  

if we have a tendency to lost in daily gross profit /daily loss

how do we make use of that -- so that we tend to win ??

I think it is hard to rewire our brain, play with bank professionals, or hit the other button, when we try to hit ONE (for buy / sell)

any one got some constructive method -- I am thinking of one for myself right now

maybe (probably) , FX got some intrinsic game design, like the machine inside casino -- normal human being got less than 5% to make money out of it -- but try to squeeze all your money IN--- and taken by the banks (could happen to stock market, but small capital stock that people don't pay much attention -- that would be better)

PIPmaker
15
PIPmaker  

Hey, ALL: I trust everybody that commented on this thread knows something about trading- and that's fine as long as you respect the "boundaries", namely your own point of view. Only youself can assess the quality or style of your trading. Despite commonly know techniques etc. trading is highly personal and embedded in everyones very own CONTEXT (including but not limited to expectations, needs, different point of views, skill, misleading how to messages from so-called gurus etc.). And there is the problem, why so many junior traders (< 3 Years) lose considerable amount of money.

Gardner: eventhough I would not repeat Walanders words I agree to his initial statements and actually understand, why he is so upset. Do you? Faith is not a basis for consistent long term success in trading (you may talk about intuition after some level of mastery that required learning within a specific context and consistent action with expected results over an extended period of time).

Making things look as simple or easy as you do is EXACTLY the kind of behaviour, that leads to mass-failure - sorry;

If things work for you that's great (for you), just please don't pass on these things as "tips", "knowledge" or "ultimate truth" for others to build a life on it. Looking at your statement, you are trading w/o stops, jumping in and out at any time and both ways. Again- if this works for you -be happy.

Much more to say, but I think you've got the message.

Now. Since this thread was about why people lose; there are several reasons and many points of failure, starting with the title. How about changing the mindset towards winning and rename the thread to "How to win 9 out of 10 trades". Then we would describe all the things it takes to become a success trader (there are plenty of books, so we cut and paste them ...) and assume failure if those rules are ignored or missed.

Trading is based on principles. If you don't know them or ignore them you will have virtually no chance of "winning", whereas winning is not defined as a small series of accidently successful trades--

Below some examples of these principles (both, related to market mechanics and behaviour -and in NO WAY complete)

- You need [a set] of your [own], working and tested trading rules

- You need to be confident, that they work and how they work

- You need to STICK to them during trading and review them after trading

- You need to expect changes in market conditions

- Trade closed bars only

- Trade one direction only. The larger timeframe will win

- Get the money management in place, needs to be simple, quick and somewhat safe.

- Don't get greedy

- Trade on entry points only

- If you miss the trade, the next trade will come around the corner - so hopefully you will still be available to catch it.

- Select any timeframe you wish, but stick to it during the trade.

- High can go much higher, low can go much lower

- High and low can turn around - quickly

....

There's A LOT more, however, those "theoretical bulletpoints" are also dependent upon the context and therefore USELESS for anyone else-especially novice traders, mainly because the whole understanding part is missing.

"In todays world of "instant gratification" people spend $5 on a single cup of coffee; how can you expect people to learn and wait 2-3 years to make it big? It needs to be instant - that's why people lose in the first place." (me)

Cheers,

PIPmaker

One of the best possible trading setups can be as simple as ONE displaced MA (7x5) used as ultimate, automatic trendline, that represents whatever the market is actually doing (hello, reallity) (try it on GBPJPY, D1 or H4 or M15). It does, of course, not alter your psychological setup or skill, but simply assists in determining the current market activity. It's like showing a door .. and you know the rest.

Tommy
970
Tommy  
Markmuffin:
I just want to start a thread on Key factors which lets mostly in losing Trade.

Why a newbie starts losing trade, what are the measures which they must follow it up to be stable if not successful.

I hope much of you will like to share your experiences across for the newbie’s.

I think the number one reason that people lose is because they don't take the time to internalize the rhythms of the currency pairs that they trade with. Each one has its own personality, so to speak, and in order to have a hope of predicting it you have to know what 'mood' it is in. Indicators like MACD and Stochastic can't help you here.

Tommy
970
Tommy  
jlgardner263:
Okay, seriously everybody, I thought this was an open community where we could all discuss real things in a real environment without any sort of judgment upon who we are, where we come from, etc.

I apologize for getting in this e-brawl with Walander, I honestly know nothing about him, but at this point do not care to learn anything about him.

I am new to this forum. Does that make me new to trading?

Answer that for yourself.

I speak of faith and confidence... does that make me a fake?

I believe not. Because I do have faith and confidence in my self. I separate my and self. I do that for a reason.

In all honesty none of you know anything about me. To call me a kid is ridiculous. I am almost thirty years old. How old are you? Who cares? I don't. I've found that my niece and nephew at my age minus ten years are as smart as I am. This is not the kind of welcome I would expect from a community of people for simply trying to express my beliefs on a topic.

I am not the type of person that likes to get into bickering matches, and yet here I am. I have just recently started posting on this forum, but I have avidly read posts and tested new ideas for months now, I don't understand why my poking my head in deserves criticism like this.

I think it is wise to consider what other people have to say before you bash, slash, and completely deny it. I don't expect much lasting success for those who have no faith in themselves. In my line of belief, there is no way to succeed without faith in something. I believe (have faith) in my own ability to trade the currency market as much as I believe in the system that I use (developed and tested! on my own) that I will throw my real money down on it. If I lost it all, I really could give a yeah, because there's more where that came from. But that's not going to happen, because, as my friend here states in his profile, "I did my homework first."

I actually didn't have to do my homework first, as I traded the stock market for 7 years. These markets function generically the same. I could trade commodities, oil, gold, forex, stocks, whatever, and achieve the same results (I would just have to be more patient.)

I could screw the whole trading game and go with a slew of other ideas that would work just as well, but I genuinely enjoy my job. I don't plan on leaving it, because it provides opportunities to help people that I otherwise wouldn't have. That's all I'm about. I want to help people. If you're the kind of person that wants to converse with someone who wants to help you out of no self interest (and yes, there is no self interest here, I am not promoting anything, I am not trying to sell you anything, I am asking for nothing, anything I do here does not earn me anything) then by all means contact me.

In regards to Roulette, I actually played European and American Roulette. This was just for fun. If you're familiar with roulette, you will know that Russian Roulette involves a revolver loaded with one bullet, and American and European Roulette are table games that you play at casinos. It's the one where the wheel spins and the ball lands on black or red. That's a very simple way of explaining it, but it should do well for a simple mind. The only reason I mentioned it was in regards to the Martingale system the boy was talking about. I played Roulette martingale style. It is a table game. It is one of my favorite games to this day, and I will tell you that if you would like to hook up in Vegas I will rape the roulette tables using my system. But in the end it's all for fun. I enjoy having fun. Sue me.

But I cannot prove this, nor will I attempt to. I know what happened, and who cares.

Thank you

I think the point is that you are Junior Member. People will always put less faith in what you have to say when you are junior, period. Does having 200+ posts and being a senior member make someone a good trader? No. It's not a perfect system.

hazelj80
170
hazelj80  
Cyclesurfer:
I think the number one reason that people lose is because they don't take the time to internalize the rhythms of the currency pairs that they trade with. Each one has its own personality, so to speak, and in order to have a hope of predicting it you have to know what 'mood' it is. Indicators like MACD and Stochastic can't help you here.

I'll agree with you there. this was said in another forum work-for-word

"usually indicators are designed for daily charts and above. yet people use them on the 5min etc and wonder why the results are patchy.

if you use indicators use the default setting. anything else is curve fitting. if it doesn't work with the default then its not going to work long term."

I think there very few indicators that will work in spot FX because they're quick enough.maybe like 10% of all the indicators out there. maybe even less. i know whole/half numbers work really well. These are just observations from one yr of live trading.

Tommy
970
Tommy  
hazelj80:
I'll agree with you there. this was said in another forum work-for-word

"usually indicators are designed for daily charts and above. yet people use them on the 5min etc and wonder why the results are patchy.

if you use indicators use the default setting. anything else is curve fitting. if it doesn't work with the default then its not going to work long term."

I think there very few indicators that will work in spot FX because they're quick enough.maybe like 10% of all the indicators out there. maybe even less. i know whole/half numbers work really well. These are just observations from one yr of live trading.

lol..I only learned it because I spent a good two years of my life coming up with indicator after indicator only to realize that there is no indicator out there (imo) that can outguess the market. The price is the only thing that matters. This is called "naked trading" and IMO it's very important. What's more important than the fact that EUR/USD is over bought or over sold is what it tends to do in those situations in the particular situation that it is in right now. You only get that kind of knowledge from lots and lots of screen time.

The brain can tune itself to any kind of seemingly random data stream if given enough time to do it. I'd guestimate that probably 80% of traders use only indicators to make trading decisions.

IMO, price relative to the current situation and past tendencies is the most important thing.

I've noticed that about whole and halfs too. Fibonacci also works to an extent because so many people believe in it. It's a kind of self fulfilling prophecy but I wouldn't base a trade on it alone.

hazelj80
170
hazelj80  

yeah, you would need something to tell you statistically where the market might be headed to do it. sorta like a "balance beam"

I believe you're correct, neither of the two alone will work by themsleves. but i believe we have about the same ideas of what works and what doesn't.

screen time is very important to new and old traders alike.

xx3xxx
1754
xx3xxx  

the best answer will be

strategy certain scenario (other scenario, your strategy will lost)

answer would be

DEMO trade, until you sustain your profitability or loss-ability

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