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Mehrdad Shiri
4449
Mehrdad Shiri 2013.06.03 04:39 

Broker's ; Are they with "sum zero game" or "try their best" going to  turn the market towards ?. (with integrated the all position's of their real account's member )

Effect of this ( if it was correct ) could be considered, for example with hidden Stop Loss and Take Profit levels.

( in this case, must always make sure that the server connection is exist.)

Is trading a zero sum game?

i mean: Stop Loss and Take Profit   (It is emphasized )

OR,

NO, there is another case.


what is your opinion about this ?

Sergey Golubev
Moderator
54522
Sergey Golubev 2013.06.03 09:52  

I did not understand sorry ... hidden take profit / stop loss are something which is inside the code of EA for example ... and there are some other kinds of exit such as 'close the position if line of [...] indicator is crossing the other line' for example. All those cases are something which are not related to the broker's server and mostly used with complex multi-timeframe / multi currency systems (usually used as a part of account protection feature).

If you place non-hidden stop loss / take profit so it is more reliable. Because we can move stop loss to profitable area, close metatrader 5 after that and go to sleep. :)

Example with non-hidden stop loss moved to profitable area

MetaTrader Trading Platform Screenshots

EURUSD, H4, 2013.05.28

MetaQuotes Software Corp., MetaTrader 5, Demo

149 pips eurusd

EURUSD, H4, 2013.05.28, MetaQuotes Software Corp., MetaTrader 5, Demo


Mehrdad Shiri
4449
Mehrdad Shiri 2013.06.03 11:57  
newdigital:

yes; you are right

all about hidden Stop Loss and Take Profit i told ; with ea can do it ( on base of trade strategy )

my question was about this:

when for a position " sl & tp " used;

are Broker's do this : with "sum zero game" or "try their best" going to  turn the market towards ?. (with integrated the all position's of their real account's member )

Sergey Golubev
Moderator
54522
Sergey Golubev 2013.06.03 12:42  

I did not understand sorry :) Are you talking about dealing desk brokers (DD) and non-dealing desk (NDD) broker?

  • DD brokers are mediating between us (traders) and the banks (liquidity providers), and because of that - DD brokers are making the market for us (for traders) controlling the market we are trading with (them).
  • NDD brokers are not mediating, that the traders are placing the orders directly to real market.

But people say that there are no so much differences between them concerning the traders' opinion ... "brokers are not our friends" - this is usual slogan which you can meet everywhere :)

My opinion: if you place stop loss and/or take profit so brokers can do nothing (not "sum zero game"; and not "try their best") ... nothing ... because tp or sl are executed by data, and datafeed is provided by broker, and this datafeed are slightly6 dofferent from one broker to an other one ... so, some traders are making EA or signal for some particular broker.

Example with some talking between traders:

  • one trader: "I created good EA and it is performing veru good with trading"
  • second trader: "performing in good way? that's fine. which broker?"

So, it is usual questions ... 

=======

As I said - hidden sl/tp is used with complex systems which are based on many indicators and one EA is trading for many pairs taking onto considerationmany timeframes on the same time (MTF EAs). Those kind of EAs are using hidden tp/sl and/or tp/sl which were coded inside the code of the EA. But irrespective off - those EAs are using hard tp/sl just in case of electricity will be switched off and so on (because hidden/coded tp/sl is not executed on the brokers' server; but hard tp/sl is directly executed on the brokers' server even if you will close your Metatrader for example).

Simon Gniadkowski
Moderator
17994
Simon Gniadkowski 2013.06.03 12:57  
TIMisthebest:

yes; you are right

all about hidden Stop Loss and Take Profit i told ; with ea can do it ( on base of trade strategy )

my question was about this:

when for a position " sl & tp " used;

are Broker's do this : with "sum zero game" or "try their best" going to  turn the market towards ?. (with integrated the all position's of their real account's member )

Are you suggesting a Broker will adjust the price that all his customers will see just to take out your SL ?  or are you saying that your Broker has some way of giving you and each of his customers different prices ?
Mehrdad Shiri
4449
Mehrdad Shiri 2013.06.03 16:04  
newdigital:

My opinion: if you place stop loss and/or take profit so brokers can do nothing (not "sum zero game"; and not "try their best") ... nothing ... because tp or sl are executed by data, and datafeed is provided by broker, and this datafeed are slightly6 dofferent from one broker to an other one ... so, some traders are making EA or signal for some particular broker.

thank you.
Mehrdad Shiri
4449
Mehrdad Shiri 2013.06.03 16:18  
RaptorUK:

1) Are you suggesting a Broker will adjust the price that all his customers will see just to take out your SL ? 

or

2) are you saying that your Broker has some way of giving you and each of his customers different prices ?

no to 2 ; there is no different in prices

my question is: with placeing sl/tp from trader's for those position's is there different  chart price , Than when it is not clear (there is no sl/tp )

and broker can not see them

Simon Gniadkowski
Moderator
17994
Simon Gniadkowski 2013.06.03 16:42  
TIMisthebest:

no to 2 ; there is no different in prices

my question is: with placeing sl/tp from trader's for those position's is there different  chart price , Than when it is not clear (there is no sl/tp )

and broker can not see them

How many hundreds of Lots do you trade ?  why else would a Broker adjust the price to take just your SL ?
Mehrdad Shiri
4449
Mehrdad Shiri 2013.06.03 17:19  
RaptorUK:
How many hundreds of Lots do you trade ?  why else would a Broker adjust the price to take just your SL ?

:-)

not just my stop loss.

" "try their best" 

thank you.

Alain Verleyen
Moderator
30295
Alain Verleyen 2013.06.03 17:47  
This is topic is only useless assumptions. If you have some evidence of an issue with a broker then provide it, otherwise you do that sow confusion among traders. If a broker traffics prices to catch your sl then we must denounce supporting evidence. Otherwise it's just the wind. Serious brokers do not practice these things.
Mehrdad Shiri
4449
Mehrdad Shiri 2013.06.03 22:07  
angevoyageur:
This is topic is only useless assumptions. If you have some evidence of an issue with a broker then provide it, otherwise you do that sow confusion among traders. If a broker traffics prices to catch your sl then we must denounce supporting evidence. Otherwise it's just the wind. Serious brokers do not practice these things.

1) with thanks to any one have comment here.

i had a question, so i wrote it here to see what is the other opinion about it.

i don't have any evidence of an issue , just some time i saw different candle in my broker plat form with the other ( Considering the time difference between them )

Although, some time (Rarely) i saw different between price value ( in extermum ) . ( ---- ?! ).

this is (onus ) from me, to checking chart and compare with the other and when ( if ) i saw this case again, i must write it here.( i will check with the other one ).

just EURUSD

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