AI 2023. Meet ChatGPT. - page 136

New comment
 
Andrey Dik #:

The "higher nervous system" operates with only an incomplete copy of information about the outside world. You're getting information from me? - then I am only in your imagination?)))))) The world quietly exchanges information without your participation in particular and without reasonable activity in general....

Objective processes beyond the boundaries of Mind's observation do not contain or transmit information. And here is why:

1. The information collected by us about the objects of the external world always contains inseparable subjective components: "perception angles" of the researcher/observer, elements of experience and personal interaction, calculation errors and inaccurate interpretations, perceptual distortions and uncertainty of knowledge boundaries, redundancy and one-sidedness of perceptions, etc. In contrast, objective processes do not build and exchange "models" of themselves in interaction, and do not "reflect" other objects. Therefore, they do not carry information. A physical process without an observer is the work of physical forces and nothing more.

2. The very essence of information is the reflection and reproduction of the received data, but physical processes do not need data and proceed without their participation. Data is the PRODUCT of PERCEPTION.

Historically, humans first developed verbal representations of objects in the external world, and only later added written representations. Today, we use complex computational and process modelling machines working with bits, but in the end, in ALL operations, we manipulate ONLY virtual models, without going beyond the current representations. These "virtual models" are just that - information. We must recognise that the true world is unknown to us and we have only a vague and very distorted idea of it.
 
A few theses:

Data is the result of perception of external stimulus by any primitive NS. They allow to develop a reflex reaction to the stimulus.

Information is a product of secondary processing and interpretation of data, produced at the level of higher nervous activity.

Information carrier - a tool of highly developed NS used to convert information into data and back. Requires technical methods and coding concepts.

Language and writing - historically developed ways of summarising, preserving and transmitting data converted into information.

Literature, painting, music and other arts are products of secondary "layering" of interpretations of information derived from data.
 
Реter Konow #:
Objective processes beyond the boundaries of Mind's observation do not contain or transmit information. And here's why:

1. The information we collect about the objects of the external world always contains inseparable subjective components: "perception angles" of the researcher/observer, elements of experience and personal interaction, calculation errors and inaccurate interpretations, perceptual distortions and uncertainty of knowledge boundaries, redundancy and one-sidedness of perceptions, etc. In contrast, objective processes do not build and exchange "models" of themselves in interaction, and do not "reflect" other objects. Therefore, they do not carry information. A physical process without an observer is the work of physical forces and nothing more.

2. The very essence of information is the reflection and reproduction of the received data, but physical processes do not need data and proceed without their participation. Data is a PRODUCT of PERCEPTION.

Historically, humans first developed a verbal representation of the objects of the external world, and only later added a written one. Today, we use complex computational and process modelling machines working with bits, but in the end, in ALL operations, we manipulate ONLY virtual models, without going beyond the current representations. These "virtual models" are just that - information. We must recognise that the true world is unknown to us and we have only a vague and very distorted idea of it.
Retag Konow #:
A few theses:

Data is the result of the perception of external influence by any primitive NS. They allow the development of a reflex response to a stimulus.

Information - a product of secondary processing and interpretation of data, produced at the level of higher nervous activity.

Information carrier - a tool of highly developed NS used to convert information into data and back. Requires technical methods and coding concepts.

Language and writing - historically developed ways of summarising, preserving and transmitting data converted into information.

Literature, painting, music and other arts are products of secondary "layering" of interpretations of information derived from data.

you have contradictory judgements. on the one hand, you say that "information" is a product of the brain and the rest of the inanimate world does not carry, transmit and in no way interact with information, and at the same time you say that NS operates with information.

make up your mind, either information is available only to living intelligent beings and then you can forget about thinking about AI, or you must admit that information exists and is available not only to the owners of the nervous system.

Question to ask: how did you learn about the Moon, stars? How is it possible to get information about the chemical composition of stars and many other things about objects to which you have no direct access and cannot touch? deal with these questions first to move on in your reasoning.

Why use concepts that lead to a dead end, use concepts that allow you to move forward in developments, ideas. it has become clear in the posts above that work is already in full swing to create hybrid organisms, synthesis of unique proteins (which will allow you to treat many incurable diseases) and much more, but you will not come to such conclusions if you continue to reason in the same way.


It's impossible to make discoveries within the framework of old concepts.

 
Andrey Dik #:

1. you have contradictory judgements. on the one hand, you claim that "information" is a product of the brain and the rest of the inanimate world does not carry, transmit and in no way interact with information, and at the same time you say that the NS operates with information.

2. make up your mind, either information is available only to living intelligent beings and then you can forget about thinking about AI, or you have to admit that information exists and is available not only to the owners of the nervous system.

...

1. There is no contradiction, because by NS, I mean the nervous system of organisms, as I have pointed out more than once.

2. I believe information is only available to living beings, as the "dead" are not involved in adaptation for survival and are "switched off" from evolution.

The human projection of "intelligence" onto computing devices does not endow them with intelligence or its priorities. Artificial Intelligence is a puppet in essence. A thing. A cunningly-blind matter. And it will always be that way with any technology.

 
Реter Konow #:
1. There is no contradiction, because by NS, I mean the nervous system of organisms, as I have pointed out more than once.

2. I believe that information is available only to living beings, since the "dead" are not involved in adaptation for the sake of survival and are "switched off" from evolution.

The human projection of "intelligence" onto computing devices does not endow them with intelligence or its priorities. Artificial Intelligence is a puppet in essence. A thing. A cunningly-blind matter. And it will always be that way with any technology.


You didn't answer the questions, come on. So, based on your inferences, information is available only to humans, therefore AI cannot work with information.
Unfortunately, further participation in the thread is no longer interesting for me.

on this forum it is unspokenly favoured to use the abbreviation NS as neural network.
 
Andrey Dik #:
...
You didn't answer the questions, but okay....
Representations of objects with which there is no physical contact are derived from the methods of working with data. If you analyse the raw data and compare it with the final conclusions, you will see what a jumble of subjective interpretations stand in between. My idea of the composition of stars is a 100500th interpretation of scraps of data obtained by scientists in laboratory conditions.

Interpretation of reality and reality are different things.
 
Andrey Dik #:

...

on this forum it is unspokenly favoured to use the abbreviation NS as neural network.
I agree, but in the context of my reasoning, you can guess that it's talking about the nervous system.
 
Andrey Dik #:

...Therefore, AI cannot work with information.....
Today, AI only works with statistics of the data given to it. Statistics are represented by humans in numbers and then converted into bits through a programme. For AI, bits are not information, they are electrical signals.

Next-generation AI will most likely create, process, and store models of objects, mimicking the workings of human thinking. But it will still be a puppet.
 
Реter Konow #:
To date, the AI only works with the statistics of the data given to it. The statistics are represented by humans in numbers and then converted into bits through a programme. For AI, bits are not information, they are electrical signals.

Next-generation AI will most likely create, process, and store models of objects, mimicking the workings of human thinking. But it will still be a puppet.

how did man know about the moon?
 

What is somehow missing in the discussion is that the result of the GPT work was a surprise for the developers themselves. They did not expect such a transition of quantity into quality. The algorithm began to think and give meaningful answers. Perhaps it is a matter of quantity, and the number of neurons in humans and animals is separated by a boundary, when quantity passes into quality and it starts to think, analyse, fantasise))))

T9 also thinks how to continue the word))))

1...129130131132133134135136137138139140141142143...214
New comment
Reason: