Bill Williams, Woodie and the game... - page 3
You are missing trading opportunities:
- Free trading apps
- Over 8,000 signals for copying
- Economic news for exploring financial markets
Registration
Log in
You agree to website policy and terms of use
If you do not have an account, please register
You could tell us how you 'feel' the market. Please divuldge more...
I 'feel' the market in many ways, you seem to like CCI so I'll try and explain how I use it. I have never tried Woodie's CCI, so this would be based on the default formula.
Key Info About CCI:
CCI = (Typical Price) - (Simple Moving Average of the Typical Price) / (0.015) x (Mean Deviation)
CCI was developed under the idea that price moves in patterns, and the price is below or above the popular values (100, -100) around 75% of the time.
How I Use It
First off, a lot of people think that CCI is useless, an indicator passed around to beginners as a sort of training wheel, in my opinion this isn't the case. The idea that CCI is often totally wrong is true however. But when CCI isn't helpful, it REALLY isn't helpful, enough to the point where recognizing unwanted patterns (I call floats) is easy, and can easily be turned into profit. Why I especially like CCI is because it reacts quickly, and for people who want to layer their trading with both short and long term trades, they can do so.
The most important tool with CCI is using different timeframes. I often check the 1-5-15-30 minute periods before I make a trade. What I look for is what each level is at, in the middle of -100/100 or below -100/100.
I also use CCI as a measuring tool to how far trends will continue (pip-wise) and how long floating patterns will continue for.
I trade GBPUSD from the hours of 600 - 1430 GMT / 6:00AM-2:30PM GMT
Example
Say for instance CCI on a 5 minutes period drops below -100. Placing a trade at this time would be silly, because very frequently CCI will go down to -200 or more. However when the -100 line is crossed it attracts my attention, first I will check the 15 minute period (3x5 = 15 (important)) to see what level the CCI is currently at. (There are always hiccups in every pattern depending on what time scale you are looking at. According to the 5 minute period CCI could be at -150, while on the 15 minute it could be hovering around 0. Same if you looked at a 30 minute scale, it could be different from the 15 minute scale).
So now I know 5min is at -150 and 15min is at 0. Now you must see how much price is fluctuating to know if this trade is worth it (CCI works best at peak hours). If price is moving then I go into the 1 minute period. Since the 5 min has been decreasing and is about to increase, the 1min period will be under -100 as well, (if it isn't, that means price isn't moving, or some sort of floating pattern will begin) and you wait till CCI takes the turn up. I place a the trade still looking at the 1min period, then switch back to the 5.
Easy Trades
The example before this showed how a full 5 minute cycle was only a hiccup in the 15 minute cycle. The same hiccups can be seen in 1min cycles and 5 minute cycles. Placing trades when there are no hiccups in either 1-5-15 are usually very strong trades. When CCI dips below -100/100 and whenever it starts to retrace it will be a strong trade. So when all of your timeframes tell you the same thing, it's an easy trade.
Levels
I like to keep track of the levels that CCI has been following. Since CCI is made to show 1/3 of total time of a cycle, you can see full cycles and part cycles. So if previous cycles have been dipping farthur down/up than the usual 100/-100 then it's a good thing to keep in mind. Generally I like to think of the cycles like this.
100/-100 +1 0.1
150/-150 +1 0.2
200/-200 +2 0.4
225/-225 +3 0.7
250/-250 +5 1.2
How the farthur up/down the CCI drops the stronger the future that trade has. However you have to keep in mind price fluctuation as well to determine strength. So seeing CCI at -300 and rounding off doesn't mean you buy. Don't get wipsawed.
Getting Wipsawed
If you aren't good at using CCI, and you don't know when to disregard the indicator you will get wipsawed a lot. But I assure you that it's very easy to recognize.
CCI gets so very confused when price reaches a low/high points, yet according to price in relation to past lows/highs do not match. You will see CCI take the usual abrupt stop, and look as if it is predicting price to go up. However many times the price will just float downwards. When the market floats it can float for a very long time, this is when long term trades come in handy.
Time
Remember that these are only my attempt at describing how I think. It's not a sure thing, just how I generally go about things. It would take hours of thinking and LOTS of writing to try and include every step I go into. This is only the very basic of thought processes. If you want to try CCI again, find your own values, and you own way of using it. All I know is that I am successful trading like this, you might be better using another method.
I'll use CCI this week, and update you with trades and trade results. If there are any other indicators you want me to look at I will try them out.
I 'feel' the market in many ways, you seem to like CCI so I'll try and explain how I use it. I have never tried Woodie's CCI, so this would be based on the default formula.
Key Info About CCI:
CCI = (Typical Price) - (Simple Moving Average of the Typical Price) / (0.015) x (Mean Deviation)
CCI was developed under the idea that price moves in patterns, and the price is below or above the popular values (100, -100) around 75% of the time.
How I Use It
First off, a lot of people think that CCI is useless, an indicator passed around to beginners as a sort of training wheel, in my opinion this isn't the case. The idea that CCI is often totally wrong is true however. But when CCI isn't helpful, it REALLY isn't helpful, enough to the point where recognizing unwanted patterns (I call floats) is easy, and can easily be turned into profit. Why I especially like CCI is because it reacts quickly, and for people who want to layer their trading with both short and long term trades, they can do so.
The most important tool with CCI is using different timeframes. I often check the 1-5-15-30 minute periods before I make a trade. What I look for is what each level is at, in the middle of -100/100 or below -100/100.
I also use CCI as a measuring tool to how far trends will continue (pip-wise) and how long floating patterns will continue for.
I trade GBPUSD from the hours of 600 - 1430 GMT / 6:00AM-2:30PM GMT
Example
Say for instance CCI on a 5 minutes period drops below -100. Placing a trade at this time would be silly, because very frequently CCI will go down to -200 or more. However when the -100 line is crossed it attracts my attention, first I will check the 15 minute period (3x5 = 15 (important)) to see what level the CCI is currently at. (There are always hiccups in every pattern depending on what time scale you are looking at. According to the 5 minute period CCI could be at -150, while on the 15 minute it could be hovering around 0. Same if you looked at a 30 minute scale, it could be different from the 15 minute scale).
So now I know 5min is at -150 and 15min is at 0. Now you must see how much price is fluctuating to know if this trade is worth it (CCI works best at peak hours). If price is moving then I go into the 1 minute period. Since the 5 min has been decreasing and is about to increase, the 1min period will be under -100 as well, (if it isn't, that means price isn't moving, or some sort of floating pattern will begin) and you wait till CCI takes the turn up. I place a the trade still looking at the 1min period, then switch back to the 5.
Easy Trades
The example before this showed how a full 5 minute cycle was only a hiccup in the 15 minute cycle. The same hiccups can be seen in 1min cycles and 5 minute cycles. Placing trades when there are no hiccups in either 1-5-15 are usually very strong trades. When CCI dips below -100/100 and whenever it starts to retrace it will be a strong trade. So when all of your timeframes tell you the same thing, it's an easy trade.
Levels
I like to keep track of the levels that CCI has been following. Since CCI is made to show 1/3 of total time of a cycle, you can see full cycles and part cycles. So if previous cycles have been dipping farthur down/up than the usual 100/-100 then it's a good thing to keep in mind. Generally I like to think of the cycles like this.
100/-100 +1 0.1
150/-150 +1 0.2
200/-200 +2 0.4
225/-225 +3 0.7
250/-250 +5 1.2
How the farthur up/down the CCI drops the stronger the future that trade has. However you have to keep in mind price fluctuation as well to determine strength. So seeing CCI at -300 and rounding off doesn't mean you buy. Don't get wipsawed.
Getting Wipsawed
If you aren't good at using CCI, and you don't know when to disregard the indicator you will get wipsawed a lot. But I assure you that it's very easy to recognize.
CCI gets so very confused when price reaches a low/high points, yet according to price in relation to past lows/highs do not match. You will see CCI take the usual abrupt stop, and look as if it is predicting price to go up. However many times the price will just float downwards. When the market floats it can float for a very long time, this is when long term trades come in handy.
Time
Remember that these are only my attempt at describing how I think. It's not a sure thing, just how I generally go about things. It would take hours of thinking and LOTS of writing to try and include every step I go into. This is only the very basic of thought processes. If you want to try CCI again, find your own values, and you own way of using it. All I know is that I am successful trading like this, you might be better using another method.
I'll use CCI this week, and update you with trades and trade results. If there are any other indicators you want me to look at I will try them out.LOL....
Ahh yes, the basic ways of trading CCI always gave me the giggles too.
Ahh yes, the basic ways of trading CCI always gave me the giggles too.
Sorry, I'm just laughing at your methods.
However,
1) Why do you need to use multiple timeframes when you can use the same indicator with different settings?
(Just a tip... it's more 'practical')
2) Why do you need to trade hooks from extremes on 5min charts?
3) Please unleach your take on 'RSI'.
Sorry, I'm just laughing at your methods.
However,
1) Why do you need to use multiple timeframes when you can use the same indicator with different settings?
(Just a tip... it's more 'practical')
2) Why do you need to trade hooks from extremes on 5min charts?
3) Please unleach your take on 'RSI'.Sigh. Might as well post yours.
1) I look at more than just CCI when going to differen't timeframes.
2) You don't have to... it depends.
3) Alright.
Sigh. Might as well post yours.
1) I look at more than just CCI when going to differen't timeframes.
2) You don't have to... it depends.
3) Alright.Sure..
The truth is J, I was entirely surprised you took my 'feel' the market question seriously in the first place.
But since you have answered, may I suggest a few add-ons to the 'feelings' you muster from your "1-5-15 Hook-from-Extremes Model" in the form of Ouija, PCP, various solvents....Alternatively, they say the 'pendulum' method
works well for automatically tracking price or I've heard you can try scrying for a more 'visual' experience.
I gave a few examples, and a simple way to use CCI. You seem to think so high of yourself, yet have put up no ideas, only complained about mine. If you don't like the methods I listed that's fine, but list reasons why.
Bottom line is making pips, and due to your insecurity with other ideas makes it seem that you struggle at this. Believe it or not there is more than one way to trade. It seems you have Bill's books and ideas, you let them narrow your mind, and not except any other ideas that work. My ideas work for me, so I think I'll stick with them.
I gave a few examples, and a simple way to use CCI. You seem to think so high of yourself, yet have put up no ideas, only complained about mine. If you don't like the methods I listed that's fine, but list reasons why. Bottom line is making pips, and due to your insecurity with other ideas makes it seem that you struggle at this. Believe it or not there is more than one way to trade. It seems you have Bill's books and ideas, you let them narrow your mind, and not except any other ideas that work. My ideas work for me, so I think I'll stick with them.
To be fair you are right about the main advantage of CCI...its fast. Secondly, you are right that the correct way to use CCI is to compare different CCI's (your method uses different timeframes... I compare different settings).
However, I didn't like your idea because I think using CCI as a 'hook from extremes' is a volatile trade. Granted it will work in certain conditions but I believe it creates too many false positives overall and is somewhat like looking for a needle in a haystack...completely unnecessary.
When I started this thread I was planning on posting my variations on some of FX Sniper's ideas and Woodies indicators.
If you want to learn about other methods using CCI then I suggest you search elsewhere because I really can't be bothered talking to you.
The reason is because you came here originally sarcastically taking the piss out of other people's posts, bragging about all the 'experience' you've had, and even saying how many pips you made 'today'.... It's just a courtesy thing.
Igorad, for example, has more than 10 yrs experience as a fund manager and you don't see him mouthing off about his 'experience' or how many pips he's made today. I know some old guys who have been trading since the eighties but they don't where it like a badge. In fact no one good ever does....
There's also the obvious assumption that I think you are a dick...
Thanks guys
Just want to thank both of you for making my day better!
B
Oh and i thought the take on CCI was interesting, to say the least...
What is the point of this thread
Could someone please explain the point of this thread