# points == pips? - page 2

Moderator
33799

graziani:

For calculations on every instrument, you should use this values:

So tickSize is the minimal price change (one pip), and tickValue is the value of one pip in the currency of your account.

This is not true, you are mixing tick, point and pip. See this topic for example.
Point, revisited - MQL4 forum
• www.mql5.com
Point, revisited - MQL4 forum
Moderator
33799

graziani:
It is not my definition, but a standard definition of a pip. Read the next post.
Can you provide us a reference for this "standard definition" ?
2072

So we are getting to point where i am the first one who googled it? :P

OK, so i googled it again at found this definition on several places, which i have read before and considered to be correct.

However, such sites are obvious b******t  and should be avoided, at least i will from now on, as wikipedia obviously has the best system for finding, filtering and ranking knowledge, and as a surprise to everyone,  you can find the definition here.

Pip Definition | Investopedia
• www.investopedia.com
The smallest price change that a given exchange rate can make. Since most major currency pairs are priced to four decimal places, the smallest change is that of the last decimal point - for most pairs this is the equivalent of 1/100 of one percent, or one basis point.
Moderator
33799

graziani:

So we are getting to point where i am the first one who googled it? :P

OK, so i googled it again at found this definition on several places, which i have read before and considered to be correct.

However, such sites are obvious b******t  and should be avoided, at least i will from now on, as wikipedia obviously has the best system for finding, filtering and ranking knowledge, and as a surprise to everyone,  you can find the definition here.

A pip is sometimes confused with the smallest unit of change in a quote, that is, tick size. Currency pairs are often quoted to four decimal places, but the tick size in a given market may be, for example, 5 ticks, or 1/2 pip.

## Fractional pips

Electronic trading platforms have brought greater price transparency and price competition to the foreign exchange markets.[2] Several trading platforms have extended the quote precision for most of the major currency pairs by an additional decimal point; the rates are displayed in 1/10 pip.

This is obviously in contradiction with what you wrote previously :

Forum

points == pips?

graziani, 2013.07.15 09:14

Pip is the most precise definition you can have.

One pip is the smallest difference between two values.

So if you have €\$ on 5 digits broker, one pip is 0.00001.

For €\$ on 4 digits broker, one pip is 0.0001.

For GOLD, one pip is 0.01.

or

Forum

points == pips?

graziani, 2013.07.15 09:27

For calculations on every instrument, you should use this values:

```tickSize = SymbolInfoDouble(symbol, SYMBOL_TRADE_TICK_SIZE);
```

So tickSize is the minimal price change (one pip), and tickValue is the value of one pip in the currency of your account.

Anyway you can define a pip as you wish, no problem for me. But you have to be consistent.
5390

angevoyageur:
"A pip is a very unprecise unit." Its definition varies from person to person.

Sorry have to dis-agree.

• If someone say they lost 9-Pips of EURUSD (most people know what it mean).
• If someone say they lost 9-Pips of USDJPY (most people know what it means).
• If someone say they lost 9-Points of EURUSD (I have to ask for symbol's digits).
• If someone say they lost 9-Points of USDJPY (I have to ask for symbol's digits ).

A Pip on EurUsd will never equal 0.00001. And will always be 0.0001.

Anyone saying a Pip=0.00001 on EurUsd is clearly confused. :)

Moderator
33799

Ubzen:

Sorry have to dis-agree.

• If someone say they lost 9-Pips of EURUSD (most people know what it mean).
• If someone say they lost 9-Pips of USDJPY (most people know what it means).
• If someone say they lost 9-Points of EURUSD (I have to ask for symbol's digits).
• If someone say they lost 9-Points of USDJPY (I have to ask for symbol's digits ).

A Pip on EurUsd will never equal 0.00001. And will always be 0.0001.

Anyone saying a Pip=0.00001 on EurUsd is clearly confused. :)

• I understand well what you wrote, but as you can see from the discussion with graziani this is not so simple.
• "Most people know..." isn't very precise. How do you know that someone "knows" what you mean. You have to be sure that your interlocutor use the same pip as your.
• You can see here, picture of point 2, that Metaquotes used the term pip for a point : "-73 pips" for the SL is -0.00073, this is 7.3 of your pips.
• I use the same pip as your, so between us a pip is a very precise unit.

Nothing is simple in communication.

5390

angevoyageur:
• I understand well what you wrote, but as you can see from the discussion with graziani this is not so simple.
• "Most people know..." isn't very precise. How do you know that someone "knows" what you mean. You have to be sure that your interlocutor use the same pip as your.
• You can see here, picture of point 2, that Metaquotes used the term pip for a point : "-73 pips" for the SL is -0.00073, this is 7.3 of your pips.
• I use the same pip as your, so between us a pip is a very precise unit.

Nothing is simple in communication.

Meta-Quotes definitions are in-consistent lol. I still believe most people know what a Pip is. Just like I believe most people know what a 1-Dollar is. Another example I'll give is an amusement park or mql5.com_credits. If I went to an amusement park and the attendant said it cost 1\$ to ride, I believe most people know what she means. However, if I said it costs 1_credit (aka point) to ride. Most people would ask well how many credits do I get for a dollar.

If someone says they're trading 1-standard Lot ... I believe most people understand it means 100,000 units of base currency. Just because some Brokers make their standard lot a micro_lot does not mean I've lost faith in the masses. Most people still know or should know what a Pip, Standard-Lot or Dollar is. Any other unit it's broken down to would be the ambiguous.

Points to me seem more Ambiguous than Pips. Imagine if I posted a system in the System Section and told my follower to set their stop_losses 100_Points  on EURUSD from their entry. That'll be total chaos. Yes I agree, in either case I'll have to add additional clarification however it'll be easier to explain Pips than Points. Example: I could say "set your stoploss 100_pips away where pip=0.0001" [I could get by with just 100_pips with most people]. If however I said 100_Points ... I would have to go into if your broker is 4-digits vs if its 5-digits vs if its 3-digits... 10 years later someone reading my system would be confused because Points is now 0.000001.

2072

angevoyageur: