Annihilator DD

SPECIAL INTRODUCTORY PRICE!! MACD Momentum Pro is a professional, fully-customisable Expert Advisor that uses closed-bar MACD crossovers, confirms trend with HMA/WMA, and filters with ADX . It’s simple to run in the MetaTrader 4 Strategy Tester, so you can backtest, optimise, and find parameters that suit any symbol and timeframe. Packed with features ATR-based SL & TP – Adapts to volatility; no more one-size-fits-all levels. Currency or % risk – Set a fixed cash amount or a percent; lots auto-c

Vizzion is a fully automated scalping Expert Advisor that can be run successfully using GBPJPY currency pair at H1 timeframe. Very Important This Expert Advisor can not run with any EAs in the same account. As part of the money management plan, it calculates and monitors the Margin Level % and assumes that all open trades are created by it. If you want an Expert Advisor that trades in a daily basis, this EA is not for you because using this requires a patience to wait for a few days or weeks on

ABCMarketsControl.ex4 utility manages already opened trades on any symbol by moving them to a breakeven when the price reaches a certain level. Besides, if the price goes further in favorable direction, the utility moves Stop Loss and Take Profit accordingly. The utility is most convenient for use on medium and long terms, as well as when trading on news. The parameters set by default are optimal, but it is better to select them individually for each trading symbol according to personal experien

The Supertrend Expert Advisor The Supertrend Expert Advisor with averaging elements. It has been developed during three months until I finally got good results. It is not a scalper. The minimum balance to start trading - 100 $. Is automatically adjusted to the 4 and 5-digit prices. Has an efficient risk management system. The lot and limit on the maximum lot is automatically calculated based on the settings specified in the EA. As a result, you have a complete automated trading system. Download

How the EA works (simple explanation) Trades on   M5   timeframe Uses   H1 timeframe   to analyze global market context Analyzes   2 or 3 timeframes simultaneously On each timeframe: Checks price position relative to one or two Moving Averages Evaluates MA angle and distance between price and MA Entry logic is based on   trend + volatility conditions , not on random signals The full algorithm is illustrated in the screenshots. Recommended usage Symbol:   EURUSD Timeframe:   M5 Trading

MACD Divergence Pro is an intelligent and adaptive Forex trading robot designed to capitalize on MACD signals and detect divergence patterns that often precede major price reversals. The EA automatically places Buy and Sell trades when: Bearish divergence is detected at market highs Bullish divergence is detected at market lows MACD crossover signals confirm potential entry points Key Features: Fully automated trading using MACD and divergence logic ️ Customizable MACD settings for f

Ilan Spirit Советник  Ilan Spirit -это аналог советника, с добавлением множества дополнительных логик и возможностей для торговли, с оставленными настройками советника . Советник торгует по системе Мартингейл с увеличением последующих лотов в серии ордеров, с целью их усреднения. Первый ордер робот выставляет по сигналам встроенного индикатора. Так же советник имеет возможность прекращать торговлю в зависимости от новостей от сигналов новостного индикатора. Ilan Spirit можно использовать либо на

MMM Zig Zag Strategy: The Expert Advisors uses its built-in Zig Zag indicator to determine the prices trends and calculates the signal to decide to open buy or sell positions. It sends an order, closes or moves the Trailing Stop loss position as the indicator works. You can define the time period of each day of the week the EA should not trade (the bad time to trade). Usually the period of day when the impact news are published. General Inputs: Closes orders with any profit of value (currency):

Magic Grid is an indicator-free advisor that uses a grid strategy. The strategy is based on automatic reopening of grid pending orders, after closing their market positions (by Take-Profit, Stop-Loss or manually). Pending orders are placed with a specified step from the initial prices, which can be entered manually or generated automatically ( one time at the beginning of the trade ). The robot can trade on any time frame, on any currency pair, on several currency pairs, and on any number of di

FDM Strategy is an Expert Advisor based on fractals and five dimension method. Five Dimensions expert system is developed based on a theory combining the Chaos Theory with the trading psychology and the effects that each has on the market movement. There is also an ADX (measuring trend strength with average directional movement index) used as a trading filter. Long and Short Trade Signals: If fractal to buy is above the Alligator's Teeth (red line), the pending Sell Stop order must be placed 1 p

The Infinity Expert Advisor is a scalper. When the resistance and support levels are broken, trades are opened in the direction of the price movement. Open positions are managed by several algorithms based on the current market situation (fixed stop loss and take profit, trailing stop, holding positions in case of trend indication, etc.). Requirements for the broker The EA is sensitive to spread, slippages and execution quality. It is strongly recommended not to use the EA for currencies with s

MACD Pro I EA https://youtu.be/2wCzTFIGNp4 =============== This Robot is fully automated and has been created for everyone. The Robot works also on cent accounts. The Ea is based on the MACD Indicator and 3 more and has been kept simple. ========================================= Maybe better to go for small profit, set it on higher time frames then you can use it for more pairs at the same time. =========================================== => works on all Time Frames but i would recommend the

Expert candle finder for forex in MetaTrader 4 Expert candle finder is one of the practical trader assistant experts that is used in the forex financial market, this expert accurately identifies the candlestick patterns on the price chart as a signal, all the found candles. informs you. This expert is run on your Meta trader platform and in a very precise way, it examines all the currency pairs that are in your watch list and every currency pair that had a professional and good candlestick patt

торговая система с риском 1% чем больше денег на счете тем больше лот но риск 1% Начальный депозит 50.00 Спред 10 Чистая прибыль 6.71 Общая прибыль 51.97 Общий убыток -45.26 Прибыльность 1.15 Матожидание выигрыша 0.02 Абсолютная просадка 26.79 Максимальная просадка 29.21 (55.47%) Относительная просадка 55.47% (29.21) Всего сделок 427 Короткие позиции (% выигравших) 219 (72.60%) Длинные позиции (% выигравших) 208 (72.12%) Прибыльные сделки (% от всех) 309 (72.37%) Убыточные сделки (% от все

PROMO: SPEND MORE TIME WITH YOUR FAMILY. ENJOY LIFE… DO NOTHING. We would like to share our coding skills to fellow traders and most especially to people from all walks of life to have the opportunity to trade or invest using auto-trading way to provide other source of income while letting the robot and your money works for you.  The trade strategy is based on Averaging and uses a little bit combination of martingale and grid strategy. Methodology   – Trading entails technical analysis with ma

Gold Label  is an Expert Advisor designed specifically for trading gold.  This EA is specifically designed for   XAUUSD  with low risk and can grow your account from small capital. It is based on machine learning cluster analysis and genetic algorithms. EA contains self-adaptive market algorithm, which uses price action patterns and standard trading indicators. Expert showed stable results on XAU in 2011-2020 period. No dangerous methods of money managment used. Suitable for any broker conditi

"Auto FIBO Pro"   Crypto_Forex  indicator  - is great auxiliary tool in trading! Indicator automatically calculate and place on chart Fibo levels and local trend lines (red color). Fibonacci levels indicate key areas where price can reverse. Most important levels are 23.6%, 38.2%, 50% and 61.8%. You can use it   for reversal scalping  or for zone grid trading. There are plenty of opportunities to  improve your current system using Auto FIBO Pro indicator as well. It has Info Spread Swap Displa

Two Kids  - high frequency EA-scalper. Two Kid s  -  uses only two standard indicators to generate signal to oder opening. Two Kids   -universal and simple. Two Kids   - trades accurately and swiftly. Two Kids   - independent on TF. Two Kids   - worsk on all currency pairs. Two Kids   - uses no martingale and no grid Two Kids   -needs 20  units of currency for lot 0.01 for each used currency pair. Two Kid s EA  Parameters : Trading  hours  HH . ММ  (server time) : trade time limit on time : tim

The MelBar HedgeScalper FinTech RoboTrader MAXIMUM LOTSIZE : 100 Lots (US$10,000,000) per TRADE/POSITION FULLY TRIED, TESTED, PROVEN & VERIFIED ON A REAL LIVE TRADING ACCOUNT! TRY OUT THE DEMO! The Experienced Trader & Global Money Manager Version. 89% Trade Winning Percentage. 32.679% Profit Gain or ROI in 2 Trading Days. Profit Factor 3.59 Average Trade Length 1h 22m. The MelBar HedgeScalper FinTech RoboTrader is easy to use. Has the Advantage of Retiring Unnecessary "Debt" Positi

Multicurrency Expert Advisor with 100% adaptation for any currency pair and timeframe. Based on the Smart Gread indicator. Very flexible setup allows you to get maximum profit. Profit from transactions is set manually in TakeProfit (standart 200 ). Lot size is set manually by Lot (standart = 1 lot). Each subsequent lot is increased by Kolen (standart 2 ). Maximum lot size MaxLot (standart 10 ). To disable the adviser, there are special functions: StopRightNow - all orders will close rig

| Fully-automated Smart Money Concept (ICT) inspired trading solution with multi-strategy capabilities | Built by a grid trader >> for grid traders.  This is MT4 version, click  here  for  Blue CARA MT5  (settings and logics are same in both versions)     Real monitoring signal  -->  Cara Gold Intro Blue CARA EA   ('CARA') - short for  C omprehensive  A lgorithmic R esponsive A dvisor is a next-gen  multi-currency    multi-timeframe  EA base on the widely known (and perhapse most popular) Inn

This is a grid Expert Advisor. It has several trading strategies based on the MACD indicator. The virtual trailing stop, stop loss, take profit levels can be set pips, in the deposit currency or as a percentage of the balance. Depending on the settings, different orders may be opened for diversifying risks. Their closure can be either an oppositely directed or unidirectional basket of orders. The orders grid is adaptive, only market orders are used in it. If the price moves the distance of Order

Clear Reversal Scalper EA This Expert Advisor is designed to identify sharp market reversal opportunities by detecting a predefined number of consecutive bullish or bearish candles, signaling potential exhaustion of the current trend. Once the reversal pattern is detected, the EA enters a trade in the direction of the large reversal candle, capitalizing on momentum for a quick scalp. This strategy works best in volatile sessions. Key Features: Reversal Pattern Detection: Customizable setting to

ReversePro SmartSMA EA – A Fully Customizable Moving Average Strategy ReversePro SmartSMA EA is an advanced yet fully customizable trading tool designed for traders who prefer to fine-tune their strategies. This Expert Advisor (EA) is not pre-optimized, allowing you the flexibility to adjust its settings to fit your trading style, risk management preferences, and market conditions. How It Works This EA is based on the well-known Simple Moving Average (SMA) crossover strategy, enhanced with addi

Generate controlled returns with an  AI-assisted , risk-diversified and Gold-optimized EA . GoldZILLA AI is a multi-strategy algorithm detecting market regimes to dynamically select from five distinct strategies, optimizing returns while minimizing drawdown on XAUUSD. [ Live Signal ] - [  Dedicated group | Version MT5 - MT4 ] After the purchase, please send me a private message to receive the user manual and the AI setup instructions. Why choose this EA? Dynamic multi-strategy approach Advanced

The robot uses the trading strategy of breaking the lines of the Bollinger Bands indicator. The essence of this strategy lies in the constant analysis of the indicator lines and the search for the most effective breakout points for its lines. When the price breaks through the indicator line in one of the directions, the robot opens a trade in that direction and starts to follow it. But the robot does not open trades every time the indicator lines are broken, but only in those places where it co

Follow us on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/project_oro_ea Project Oro is a trading algorithm project that I began approximately six years ago. After countless painful and excruciating hours of coding, it is finally ready to be released to the public. The Expert Advisor (EA) is built on a proprietary and unique technique that analyzes the behavior and movement of candlesticks and the price action within the gold market. It searches for short windows of opportunity to strike and exits tr

The Official Automated Version of the Reliable Indicator PipFinite Breakout EDGE EA Breakout EDGE takes the signal of PipFinite Breakout EDGE indicator and manages the trade for you. Because of numerous financial instruments to consider, many traders want the signals to be fully automated. The EA will make sure all your trades are executed from entry to exit. Saving you time and effort while maximizing your profits. The Edge of Automation Effortless price action trading is now possible acros

We do not want to make you confused with an imaginary high profit screenshot from Strategy Tester which has no relation/guarantee of future profit! We just want to tell you the real thing about our EA. TrendEx Pro has been developed to trade on Gold specially, combining multiple strategies algorithm to ensure Trend catching and trading on. It can identify both short and long trends and opens positions accordingly with excellent built-in risk management logic. There is no use of any dangerous met

Jet Punch is another best expert advisor for MT4,  can help you make money while you sleep by automatically entering and exiting trades. It trades by opening trades every day and closing them at the right time to ensure you always earn a profit. The software is very simple and can be used by both beginner and experienced traders.  Jet Punch was tested and has successfully passed the stress test with slippage and commission approximate to the real market condition. Recommendations: Currency pair:

Experience exceptionally  fast trade copying with the Local Trade Copier EA MT4 . With its easy 1-minute setup, this trade copier allows you to copy trades between multiple MetaTrader terminals on the same Windows computer or Windows VPS with lightning-fast copying speeds of under 0.5 seconds. Whether you're a beginner or a professional trader, the Local Trade Copier EA MT4 offers a wide range of options to customize it to your specific needs. It's the ultimate solution for anyone looking to inc

It helps to calculate the risk per trade, the easy installation of a new order, order management with partial closing functions, trailing stop of 7 types and other useful functions. Additional materials and instructions Installation instructions   -   Application instructions   -   Trial version of the application for a demo account Line function -   shows on the chart the Opening line, Stop Loss, Take Profit. With this function it is easy to set a new order and see its additional characteris

Welcome to Trade Manager MT4 - the ultimate   risk management tool   designed to make trading more intuitive, precise, and efficient. This is not just an order placement tool; it's a comprehensive solution for seamless trade planning, position management, and enhanced control over risk. Whether you're a beginner taking your first steps, an advanced trader, or a scalper needing rapid executions, Trade Manager MT4 adapts to your needs, offering flexibility across all markets, from forex and indice

Custom Alerts AIO: All-in-One Market Scanner – No Setup Required Overview Custom Alerts AIO is the fastest and easiest way to monitor multiple markets for real-time trading signals—without any setup or extra licenses. It comes with all required Stein Investments indicators already embedded, making it the perfect plug-and-play solution for traders who value simplicity and performance. Just load it to any chart and start receiving alerts across Forex, Metals, Crypto, and Indices. Shares can be a

Unlimited Trade Copier Pro is a tool to copy trade remotely to multiple MT4, MT5 and cTrader accounts at different computers/locations over internet. This is an ideal solution for you if you are a signal provider and want to copy your trades to other receivers globally on your own rules. One provider can copy trades to multiple receivers and one receiver can get trade from multiple providers as well. The provider can even set the subscription expiry for each receiver, so that receiver will not b

Copy Cat More Trade Copier MT4 is not just a simple local trade copier; it is a complete risk management and execution framework designed for today’s trading challenges. From prop firm challenges to personal portfolio management, it adapts to every situation with its blend of robust execution, capital protection, flexible configuration, and advanced trade handling. The copier works in both   Master (sender) and Slave (receiver)   modes, with real-time synchronization of market and pending orders

Professional Trade Copier for MetaTrader 4 Fast, professional, and reliable trade copier for MetaTrader 4 . COPYLOT helps you copy Forex trades between MetaTrader 4 and MetaTrader 5 terminals with flexible synchronization for different account setups. COPYLOT MT4 version supports: MetaTrader 4 to MetaTrader 4 MetaTrader 5 Hedge to MetaTrader 4 MetaTrader 5 Netting to MetaTrader 4   MT5 version Full Description + DEMO + PDF How To Buy How To Install How to get Log Files How To Test and Optimize A

Telegram to MT4: The Ultimate Signal Copying Solution Streamline your trading with Telegram to MT4 , the cutting-edge utility designed to copy trading signals directly from Telegram channels and chats to your MetaTrader 4 platform—without the need for DLLs. This robust solution ensures seamless execution of signals with unparalleled precision and customization options, saving you time and boosting your efficiency. [ Instructions and DEMO ] [ FAQ ] [ How atach logs properly ] [Settings descrition

Trade Panel is a multi-functional trading assistant. The app contains over 50 trading functions for manual trading and allows you to automate most trading tasks. Before making a purchase, you can test the demo version on a demo account. Download the trial version of the application for a demonstration account: https://www.mql5.com/en/blogs/post/750865 . Full instructions here . Trade. Allows you to perform trading operations in one click: Open pending orders and positions with automatic risk cal

The trend in the market can be predicted using trend lines but the problem is you don’t know where exactly the price is going to touch the trend line where you can put your pending orders on. Smart Channel Expert Advisor makes it possible to put an advanced channel around the price data, which can be configured to handle placing orders, opening and closing positions, managing risk per trade, spread, slippage, and trailing stop-loss and take-profit automatically. Features Money Management (Calcul

The product will copy all telegram signal to MT4   ( which you are member  ) , also it can work as remote copier.  Easy to set up, copy order instant, can work with almost signal formats, image signal, s upport to translate other language to English Work with all type of channel or group, even channel have "Restrict Saving Content", work with  multi channel, multi MT5 Work as remote copier: with signal have ticket number, it will copy exactly via ticket number. Support to backtest signal. How to

Trade Copier is a professional utility designed to copy and synchronize trades between trading accounts. Copying occurs from the account / terminal of the supplier to the account / terminal of the recipient, which are installed on the same computer or VPS . PROMOTION - If you have already purchased the "Trade Copier MT5," you can receive the "Trade Copier MT4" for free (for copying MT4 > MT5 and MT4 < MT5). For more detailed information about the conditions, please contact us via private message

Close If Profit or Loss with Trailing for MetaTrader 4 — automatic closing by total profit or loss A reliable trade-management utility for MetaTrader 4 that automatically closes positions when the total profit or total loss reaches the level you set. The Expert Advisor monitors open trades, calculates floating profit and loss, can trail profit, and helps close positions faster than manual reaction. MetaTrader 4 is still used by many manual traders, grid traders, scalpers, and Expert Advisor use

Trading History - A program for trading and money management on the history of quotes in stratagy tester. It can work with pending and immediate orders, and is equipped with trailing stop, breakeven and take profit functions. Very good for training and testing different strategies. Manual (Be sure to read before purchasing) Advantages 1. Allows you to test any trading strategy in the shortest possible time 2. An excellent simulator for trading training. You can gain months of trading experience

Elevate Your Trading Signals with Our Advanced Telegram Bridge EA It’s time to captivate your audience with real-time trading updates that are both professional and visually appealing. Contact me to receive a trial and see the demo channel! We have significantly invested in user friendly features that create a unique experience for customers and providers.  SIGNAL BRIDGE is able to deliver 100% COPIER FRIENDLY SIGNALS for all business cases, even bypassing Metatrader logics where other EAs stru

This is a simple utility which will put Automatic Stop Loss and Take Profit. It also has Trailing Stop Loss and Break Even features. The input value of the Stop Loss and Take Profit is in Pips. Whenever you open a trade it will put stop loss and take profit in pips automatically. *If you need a more practical stop loss and take profit for your trades then you may like this ATR based stop loss utility,  Here! Inputs: 1. SL and Trailing SL - This is the Stop Loss value in Pips. Also used as Traili

Trade Dashboard simplifies how you open, manage, and control your trades, with built-in lot size calculation. It allows you to execute trades, manage risk, and control positions directly on the chart, with tools such as partial close, breakeven, and trailing stop. Designed to reduce manual work and help you stay focused on your trading decisions. A demo version is available for testing. Detailed explanations of features are provided within the MQL5 platform. Installation instructions are include

Telegram to MT4 Multi-Channel Copier automatically copies trading signals from your Telegram channels directly into MetaTrader 4. No bots, no browser extensions, no manual copying. You receive a signal on Telegram and the EA opens the trade on your terminal in a few seconds. The product includes two components: a Windows application that listens to your Telegram channels, and this Expert Advisor that executes the signals on your MT4 terminal. An MT5 version is also available. Setup guide and app

This product filters all expert advisors and manual charts during news time. It is able to remove any of your EA during news and automatically reattach them after news ends. This product also comes with a complete  order management system that can handle your open positions and pending orders before the release of any news. Once you purchase The News Filter , you will no longer need to rely on built-in news filters for future expert advisors, as this product can filter them all from here onwards

This tool adds alerts to your Fibo Retracement and Fibo Expansion objects on the chart. It also features a handy menu to change Fibo settings easily and quickly! Features Alert for Fibo Retracement and Fibo Expansion levels. Sound, Mobile and Email alert. Up to 20 Fibo Levels. Continuous sound alert every few seconds till a user clicks on the chart to turn it OFF. Single sound alert with pop-up window. Keeping all user settings even after changing timeframes. New handy menu to change Fibo setti

RRBCTC uses real Tick data to create custom Range, Time, Renko and Volume bar charts for MT4. Tick data use is RRBCTC unique feature, which allows highest quality charting of current and historical price movement. Custom inputs provide option to create range bars with sizes from 0.1 pip all the way to 100+ pip and time bars periods from second all the way to a month. Charts are updated with new data in real time, allowing user use of MT4 indicators and advisors (EA). RRBCTC greatly extends MT4 c

Auto Trade Copier is designed to copy trades to multiple MT4, MT5 and cTrader accounts/terminals with 100% accuracy. The provider and receiver accounts must be on the same PC/VPS. With this tool, you can copy trades to receiver accounts on the same PC/VPS. All trading actions will be copied from provider to receiver perfectly. This version can be used on MT4 accounts only. For MT5 accounts, you must use Auto Trade Copier for MT5 . Reference: - For MT4 receiver, please download Trade Receiver Fre

News filter, equity guard & session control for all your EAs — one tool, full protection Take a Break has evolved from a basic news filter into a comprehensive account protection solution . It pauses your other Expert Advisors during news events or based on custom filters. When trading resumes, it automatically restores your entire chart setup , including all EA settings. Why traders choose Take a Break One news filter for all your EAs — no more relying on individual built-in filters that may o

This EA Utility allows you to manage (with advanced filtering) unlimited open orders (manual or EA) with 16 trailing stop methods: fixed, percent, ATR Exit, Chandelier Exit, Moving Average, Candle High Low Exit, Bollinger Bands, Parabolic, Envelope, Fractal, Ichimoku Kijun-Sen, Alligator, Exit After X Minutes or Bars, RSI and Stochastic. The trailing stop can be either real or virtual, and you can exit fully or with a partial close percent on touch or bar close.  Moreover, you can add (overrid

With this Expert Advisor you will follow the sound trading principle Buy Low and Sell High by default ! And you can do that even with a normal day job . You will be even able to trade on lower timeframes which you could never do without such an Expert Advisor. And the best thing is that you are in control! You can tell the Edge Zone EA where it has to enter and where it has to exit. And you can do that even many hours before the trade will occur . This EA is therefore an excellent assistant for

DaneTrades Trade Manager is a professional trade panel for MetaTrader 4, designed for fast, accurate execution with built‑in risk control. Place market or pending orders directly from the chart while the panel automatically calculates position size from your chosen risk, helping you stay consistent and avoid emotional decision‑making. The Trade Manager is built for manual traders who want structure: clear risk/reward planning, automation for repeatable management, and safeguards that help reduc

MultiOrder Assistent V3.0   - Your professional trading assistant for MetaTrader 4 The  MultiOrder Manager  is a powerful trading tool designed to optimize your trading while managing risk efficiently. With intuitive features and a user-friendly interface, this Tool is ideal for traders who want to manage multiple orders simultaneously without losing track.   Symbols: FX pairs, gold and cryptocurrencies Here you get a detailed description of the parameters and functions Manual     Features and

Grid Manual is a trading panel for working with grid strategies. The utility is universal, has flexible settings and an intuitive interface. It works with a grid of orders not only in the direction of averaging losses, but also in the direction of increasing profits. The trader does not need to create and maintain a grid of orders, the utility will do it. It is enough to open an order and the Grid manual will automatically create a grid of orders for it and will accompany it until the close. Ful

Easy Trade – Smart, Simple, Powerful Trade Management Easy Trade is the all-in-one trade management solution for MetaTrader users who want to keep risk under control and execution ultra-smooth. Designed from scratch with trader feedback in mind, Easy Trade makes it easy to execute, monitor, and manage trades across multiple symbols – without overcomplicating your workflow. Whether you're scalping manually or managing a small portfolio of setups, Easy Trade keeps your focus where it belongs: on

Automatic profit locking when target profit is reached EquityTargetCloser   — is a utility expert advisor for MetaTrader 5 that automatically closes all market positions and deletes pending orders as soon as   equity exceeds the current balance by a specified profit amount . After all positions are closed, the target automatically increases: the new threshold = new balance + specified profit. The EA does not open trades, it only manages existing positions, helping to reliably lock in profit and

The auxiliary adviser is designed to transfer profitable positions without loss. The adviser does not trade itself, it opens two oppositely directed positions in the tester to demonstrate the work. Settings: Start no loss (>size) -  after how many points does it start without a loss. Size no loss (<start) -  size without loss. (size without loss must be less than start)